Talk:Oberth class/archive

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Oberth class

Since the Oberth model as seen in the auction was still labeled as the Pegasus from its TNG appearance, which was also its next-to-last, can we now assume that the fabled USS Valiant NCC-20000 doesn't exist? Has anyone been able to find a picture of the model with this name and registry? -- SmokeDetector47^{( TALK )} 03:47, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

background note should cover it. let the reader decide.

"Let the reader decide" only works in a small number of cases. We are trying to be as accurate an encyclopedia as possible. --OuroborosCobra ^talk 05:33, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

but we don't know. so we can either pick an angle and go with it or put it in the background and let the reader pick.

We don't know "yet". Therefore, the correct action is to find the answer, not take the easy route. --OuroborosCobra ^talk 05:55, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

I'm not entirely sure that is definitive proof. I made caps from one of the Trek DVDs that shows the Oberth with the Valiant labels. So clearly it did exist in some form at some state of production. --Alan del Beccio 00:08, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

The only pics I've been able to find with an Oberth labeled as "Valiant" are at the bottom of this page [1] (from the Star Trek III DVD bonus features?), and those are of the study model and not the actual filming model (besides, there's no registry to be seen). Is there another DVD bonus feature that showed the filming model with the Valiant labels? -- SmokeDetector47^{( TALK )} 07:34, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Valiant concept

This is most likely the image that's being talked about, but it's of a concept model, not the filming miniature, and it's from Star Trek 3, not 7. --Pearse 19:06, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, that isn't image I was referring to, it was actually a complete overhead shot of the ship, and honestly, I can't recall where I originally saw it, I seemed to have deleted the capture, but it probably was from STIII, which still confirms my original statement, "it did exist in some form at some state of production." Confirming the registry would still be nice...--Alan del Beccio 19:29, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

File:Valiant oberth temp.jpg

Valiant overhead

Here's an overhead shot I found on the Star Trek III DVD; however, this is the same study model shown above and not the filming model. -- SmokeDetector47^{( TALK )} 21:29, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

First Contact?

I've read on a couple of sites (namely EAS and TrekMania) that the Oberth-class appeared in the First Contact battle with the Borg and having read this article, FC is listed as one of the Oberth's appearances. Does anyone have a screencap or two of when it was shown? – The preceding unsigned comment was added by RedSavageWarrior (talk • contribs).

No, but I can direct you to it :-) At time index 9.22, an Oberth-class swoops around the Borg Cube in the lower-middle to lower-left part of the screen. It also fires a phaser beam, making it the only on-screen appearance of an Oberth firing weapons. - Mada101 00:10, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

here is the action

here are the ships --Alan 20:10, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Unfortunately those werent weapons. As the Oberths are undervalued in combat, their commanders have developed space highbeams. These were used in an attempt to blind the Borg from the fact that an out of universe object (the millenium falcon) was attacking it. If they had assimilated that, who knows what would of happened. – The preceding unsigned comment was added by 97.104.32.27.

Studio model

Perhaps we could move this into the studio model or even the Oberth-class article. It seems like this would be more supportive of the information on either of those pages (mostly the studio model page) than as a stand alone. --Alan 18:00, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

Agreed. Merge with studio model. --From Andoria with Love 05:26, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Eh, I merged it here, and maybe with a little more information, like some sources it might have some relevent content to add on the studio model page as well. --Alan 16:35, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Specialized Shields?

As a science vessel, the Oberth-class was designed with specialized shields, which allow them to push through gravitational wavefronts. In conjunction with this feature, the interior bulkheads were composed of victurium alloy to better facilitate shielding. (TNG: "Hero Worship")

Is this a canon design of all Oberth class vessels or just the USS Vico? Satyrquaze 18:49, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

La Forge says: "we'll have to push through the gravitational wavefronts -- just like the science vessel was designed to do." Was one ship of this class of science vessels designed thus, or was the very class of science vessels designed thus? One of those seems more plausibble to me than the other, but if you're looking for evidence rather than plausibility, then, take that as you will. --TribbleFurSuit 19:01, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

Claim about withdrawal from service

"The class would slowly be phased out of service during the 2370s, shortly after the introduction of the more advanced Nova-class science vessel."

Where in the Voyager episode "Equinox" did it say this? It sounds like speculation to me. Of course the class of ship would have to be withdrawn from service at some point, but the article simply states it as if it were directly claimed in "Equinox." 98.197.198.167 07:56, December 7, 2009 (UTC)

I believe the claim is made based on the fact that the Oberths were not seen past First Contact(during the battle) and the Nova class was described as a science vessel, which the Oberth is. I'm not sure if there are any specific statements (in canon, or even from the crew) about a deliberate effort to not use Oberths, though.--31dot 11:17, December 7, 2009 (UTC)

separate "transport chamber" in science ops?

The article currently states:

Another section, known as science ops, contained multiple computer consoles, a transport chamber (used for collecting extravehicular objects) and a personnel transporter pad. (TNG: "Realm of Fear")

I just looked through the script for this episode, as well as the screenshots on Trekcore, and didn't see any separate "transport chamber" in addition to the personnel transporter pad which featured quite prominently in the episode. I don't recall seeing any such thing when I saw the episode on DVD either (about a year ago, so admittedly not as fresh, which is why I checked the screenshots). Has anyone else spotted this? It would seem, in fact, that the existence of such a separate chamber wouldn't even make sense, because if it was used for collecting extravehicular objects, then why, as was stated in the episode, did the crew of the Yosemite use the personnel transporter pad instead to beam in a sample of the plasma streamer? Anyway, I just wanted to float this around before removing the reference from the article, in case there's something I missed. -Mdettweiler 04:08, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Without knowing exactly it could be that the statement combines several episodes into one sentence but only referenced the one. You might not find the answer in "Realm of Fear" at all but in a different episode like "The Pegasus" or "The Naked Now". — Morder (talk) 05:21, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

After reviewing the episode I found the reference to the transport chamber by Worf at 9:32 into the episode. The transport chamber, I doubt, is separate from a transporter in anyway and it's just Worf using the title to explain where in the transporter unit the explosion happened (as opposed to a transporter pad). It's probably speculation by the original author about "extravehicular objects" — Morder (talk) 05:27, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Ah, yes, I see that too. Since Worf was clearly referring to the personnel transporter pad when he said that line, I've removed the reference to a separate chamber from the article. -Mdettweiler 11:45, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Saucer/Engineering Hull

How do you get from the saucer to the engineering hull? It seems the extremely angled connections outboard are the only place a lift could be but that seems overly complicated. – The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.252.134.6.

Why? There's no "up" in space, so you can have a turbolift travel in a diagonal path (when compared to the vertical axis of the ship). In answer to your question, we don't actually know, it has never been shown in canon. --OuroborosCobra ^talk 23:52, April 9, 2011 (UTC)

Phased out?

"The class would slowly be phased out of service during the 2370s, shortly after the introduction of the more advanced Nova-class science vessel. (VOY: "Equinox")"

I don't remember hearing that in Equinox. - Mitchz95 04:05, January 11, 2012 (UTC)

Inferior

"They were tactically inferior to such enemy vessels as the Klingon Bird-of-Prey and the Borg cube. (Star Trek III: The Search for Spock; DS9: "Emissary"; Star Trek: First Contact)"

Is this necessary? Kruge's BoP beat the Grissom due to a "lucky shot" and since the preceeding paragraph notes its unimpressive defensive systems, I don't think it's worth pointing out that it's inferior to a Borg Cube. - Mitchz95 00:48, March 2, 2012 (UTC)

Phaser banks

Star Trek RPG books report only one phaser bank, type V, instead of two type IV... --87.9.134.231 21:57, May 7, 2013 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure those aren't canon. - Mitchz95 (talk) 23:41, May 7, 2013 (UTC)

Decks

There's no way an Oberth has 13 decks. It's way too small for that. Five to six decks is more likely. 98.239.91.1 08:36, June 3, 2013 (UTC)

I think the count is from the MSD image in the article, and it does seem to be correct. 31dot (talk) 11:23, June 3, 2013 (UTC)

The MSD is incorrect. If you go by the measurements given for the class (length, height etc) then the math simply doesn't add up. The decks would be far less than 2 meters tall. What Lilliputian crew would be manning these vessels? Certainly not humans. 98.239.91.1 21:55, June 5, 2013 (UTC)

The MSD is what it is. I don't believe the measurements have been given in canon so there is room for variation. Klingon Birds of Prey come in different sizes, why not other ships? 31dot (talk) 02:52, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

No disrespect, but that's a pretty crummy attitude. If we think that way then why bother keeping data on anything? What we do have are the official measurements of other starship types and we've seen the Oberth on screen side by side with these known types. It doesn't take a math whiz to calculate size estimates based on this. And those numbers don't hold water when you want them to support thirteen decks and a crew of nearly 100 individuals. Not when we're talking Human beings and human-like aliens. 98.239.91.1 08:45, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

When exactly did an "estimate" become a fact? - Archduk3 08:56, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

I was not conveying any particular attitude; I was simply stating that our content is based on what is given in the episodes and films and not based on estimates of the size. Measurements of the ship were never given in an episode or film (which is the case with most ships) but an MSD has been. 31dot (talk) 09:30, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

Civilian use?

Was just wondering if the civilian use has any source? I might just be missing it in the page but couldnt find any and cant remember a source my self for this claim. Mojo 18:04, October 27, 2015 (UTC)

I haven't watched these episodes in a long time, but I'm pretty sure that in one of the times Worf's parents visit him, they come on an Oberth class described as a civilian transport. And of course the Vico has an SS registry, and I think it was mentioned sometime in 'Hero Worship' that it was a civilian science vessel. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 21:24, January 16, 2016 (UTC)