Designation: "Borg diamond"? Edit
I wonder if this should be moved from this non-canon name to something like; "Borg Queen's ship"? Jaf 14:31, 26 February 2006 (UTC)Jaf
- It's not really non-canon, per se, as the name is taken from the shape of the ship. Since a number of Borg ships are named after their shape, it would seem plausible to call it the Borg Diamond. - Adm. Enzo Aquarius 14:48, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
I removed the following speculation:
- It is possible that the "Borg diamond" was rebuilt after its original destruction considering that the interior of the "Borg Queens" lair in "Unimatrix zero part 1" was exactly the same as the interior of the borg diamond.
--From Andoria with Love 01:44, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
Presence at assimilation Edit
Concerning this line "It was assumed that Seven of Nine and the Borg Queen were aboard while this assimilation took place."
There's no need to assume, for they are definitely there. Evidences:
- The environment shake when the battle began & the Queen said to 7 that they will be destroyed if done nothing. After adaptation, the shaking stop.
- 7 of 9 walk amongst the people captured for assimilation & she help some escaped.
- The Queen said this mission is to give 7 a first hand experience again.
This page was renamed from Borg diamond without comment back in 2007, even though the only discussion on the name on this page doesn't really go either way. Was there some discussion on this elsewhere? Both names are descriptive, both are used off site for this ship type, but only one can't be used for the cubes and spheres the Queen has been on. That, along with the pattern of Borg name designations, not to mention a Borg ship type named after an individual just seems wrong, seem to indicate that we should move this back. This would also be a split of sorts, as the class/type info (with the page history) is what would be renamed, while the vessel info itself would remain at this name. - Archduk3 08:29, June 4, 2012 (UTC)
- Support your idea. 31dot 10:36, June 4, 2012 (UTC)
- I've done some quick research, though there is very little info available on the ship it is in Fact Files referred to as "Borg Queen's Vessel" (note the capitals), whereas both Star Trek: The Magazine and Brandon MacDougall on his website, who built the CGmodel refer to it as the "Borg Queen Ship" (in the first case again with capitals, suggesting designation, at least behind-the-scenes), also capitalized referred to by Adam Lebowitz in an article in Sci-Fi & Fantasy Models issue 41`, p. 25. The Cinefantastique issue mentioned in the article refers to it as simply the "Queen's Ship" (both capitalized and uncapitalized). It seems to me the shiptype is as debatable as the larger debate about the introduction of an individual, "The Queen", into the hive. Thusfar, as far as I could discern the term "diamond" was only used in a descriptive manner in bgsources, not as a designation...Do we know for certain the type was in general use within the collective is in my opinion as valid as the question whether we know for certain if the type was for exclusive use for the queen only...That being said, due to the lack of any further info on this particular type I'm impartial either way, though, due to the fact that I haven't encountered the term "Borg Diamond" yet in any valid bgresource, I've a slight preference for the either one of the above mentioned terms, as they were...just some food for thought--Sennim 12:28, June 4, 2012 (UTC)
Those are certainly interesting finds. It would seem "Borg Queen Ship" has the highest precedence here so far, since I've never been sure which number the Fact Files is at for any given piece of info. Diamond is what's used in almost all non-canon sources, where there are more than just the one ship, though none of that trumps what we have so far. I would really like to know if Mr. MacDougall has preference, as he didn't link with the ship's page itself here but rather with the character's, or if Mr. Curry does. That said, all these names sound horrible with a "type" after it, and while we don't necessarily need to separate the type info right now, it would still be nice. Does anyone have the script for this episode? That should have some info that's worth looking at. - Archduk3 10:19, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
- While I do not, apparently the author of the article had access to the script, since he is quoting from it in the bg-section :)...--Sennim 12:04, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
- [edit conflict] I do, and it commonly refers to it as "BORG QUEEN'S VESSEL" (full caps). It should be noted, however, that the vessel's distinctive diamond shape was probably not decided upon yet, as is implied in the bg info of this article. --Defiant 12:06, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
- Nice! That settles it I think. Though "Borg Queen's Vessel" and "Borg Queen Ship" are now tied, I think the script has precedence.--Sennim 12:26, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
As for if there was more than one of these in canon, since this vessel was part of the unicomplex, or at least docked within it, all the scenes with the Borg Queen in both parts of "Unimatrix Zero" and in "Endgame" could conceivably take place in another vessel(s) of the same type, since if I'm correct the same set was used for all four episodes, which at least implies that there are more. While that's not enough for the in universe sections, if anyone has info on the set for the bg section that would be nice. - Archduk3 20:46, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
- While I can't speak for the sets (which undoubtedly are the same), even firm confirmation cannot resolve that issue. For one, "Endgame" plays out in another time-line (if memory serves, Janeway in that episode merely stated that she had beaten the Queen, before but that doesn't necessarily means the destruction of her vessel as well, it's an altenate timeline after all). Secondly, though not to be taken canonically, the writings in the Fact Files and The Magazine strongly suggest a special purpose vessel (the more or less consistent use of capitals supports that) and it is therefore equally conceivable that when a Queen with her ship is destroyed, a single new one is constructed when a new Queen is resurrected. I think there is too little info available to definitely go either way and therefore we are stuck with only what we do know for certain...the one ship as seen--Sennim 10:53, June 7, 2012 (UTC)
- Heck, you're right, I got my Janeways mixed up...As the good captain used to say, ""Temporal mechanics gives me a headache" :)--Sennim 11:16, June 7, 2012 (UTC)
I've removed the rename request, as we now have enough info to show that the page was apparently moved with good reason. I don't think we need to capitalize "vessel" though, as it's likely the name was always meant to be descriptive, and that the later publications were using the script info, either directly or indirectly. - Archduk3 13:22, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
- Did some minor layout adjustment on the BG-section; checked the season 7 DVD specials, but no confirmation on the sets, alas...Has anybody noticed that the fans got it wrong where the term "Borg diamond" is concerned? It does NOT follow "the naming conventions used in describing the cube and sphere". Diamond is a proper name for a mineral, whereas "cube" and "sphere" are terms for geometrical shapes. The proper designation should have been "Borg hexagon" :)--Sennim 13:54, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
Information Discrepancy Edit
Under the Borg Queen article under the history section it is suggested that the Borg Queen does not have her own vessel, this article seems to suggest otherwise--22.214.171.124 21:59, November 2, 2014 (UTC)